Electrical: to much or not enough. - Realm of Excursion



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Old 04-12-2013   #1 (permalink)
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Default Electrical: to much or not enough.

Howdy folks, I planing a new system out, bigger then anything I have attempted before, and I plan on upgrading all my electrical before I even purchase the amp and subs. Too many times have i rushed a system together and just looked sloppy and i felt like a idiot sitting at a light with my light dimming to the beat.
Im sure this is common knowledge for some of you, but im not sure. I have read thru alot of the stickies and got some good info from there, i just need reassurance I guess.

My Car currently:
2004 grand prix
3.8l
stock alt 125 amps
Big three ran in 4 gauge
4ga Power wire
my ebay special amp VVME inno 1500 dims my lights
amp is powering 1 15" kicker cvr at 1ohm

System im looking to install:
2 AQ HDC3'S 12'S
2 AQ Q1-2200D'S

My proposed electrical lay out is:
HO alt 200-300amp
2-3 XS power D3400's one under hood and 1 or 2 in trunk
2 runs of OFC 0ga from + and - front to back
change big three over to OFC 0ga

based off of 4400watts divided by 14.4 (high i know) at 80% efficiency im looking at 381amps just on amps not including stock electrical on top of that.

Is that enough juice or possibly to much? the biggest system i have ran before was a RF T-1500bdcp pushing 12" stroker and i used stock battery in front and kinetik hc1400. seemed ok, but i didn't have voltage meter ran so not really sure. And yeah i had a extra battery but wasn't a hundred percent sure on what it did or if it was even appropriate for my vehicle since I still had wet cell up front.

Since i am running 2 lines between batteries should i also run to lines from alt to first battery?

Could I go with 200 amp alt with the three batteries or should I look at 270-300amps still. I found 200 amp alt on knu koncept website for $255, any one have experience with their alts? Other then that I am looking at $400 and up, dont want to skimp on the alt but if i can still keep price tag down i would prefer to do that.

With running my - back battery to front battery that is grounded with big three should i still run a extra ground from the back batteries to chassis? its unibody so it will suck either way but would more help?

So in conclusion To much or not enough? I don't want to Build a system and just screw everything up cause i skimped on the electrical but as im figuring everything out im looking at spending more on electrical then i am on subs and amps

thanks in advance i know there are some great minds on here when it comes to this stuff, i appreciate any and all help


Also any suggestions on head units would be appreciated too, its a double din but i have a single in there now so either one would be ok. Thanks
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Old 04-12-2013   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

need more than 2 runs of 1/0. w/ ~400 amps of draw i'd shoot for 3 pos 1/0 2 neg 1/0, and a ground to all 4 strut towers.

w/ that setup i would run 2+ off the alt to back 1+ alt to batt, and 1+ batt front to back.

W/ the ground i would run 1 neg run alt to back, 1 neg run bat to back, 1 strut tower up front to alt, 1 strut tower up front to batt, then 1 neg alt to batt.

Thats a lot of wire and a bit complicated but imo wire is the most overlooked electrical component. I have my grand prix setup very similar to that. w/ a 270a alt g31 deka in the back, g34 deka under the hood i can hold solid 14.4v on 4kw.
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Old 04-12-2013   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

That is a lot of wire! Lol. I'm pretty sure I follow what your saying as far as how to run them, I was going to ask about running from the alt straight back so thanks for that as well. Is their a cheaper alternative to xs power batteries? I'm assuming deka is good since you are running them, I will have to look into those.

Any suggestion on how to hide all that wire? And when you say - alt to batt,'is that just using alternator mounting bolts as the ground? Thank you
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Old 04-12-2013   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtydonkey View Post
That is a lot of wire! Lol. I'm pretty sure I follow what your saying as far as how to run them, I was going to ask about running from the alt straight back so thanks for that as well.
Woo another GP person. Any reason why you're going with AQ everything. Their amps are great bit I've heard iffy things about their subs.

Running dedicated wires from the front to back is what I did. I'm not rurring as much power so I only have one + and - run of 1/0 from my front battery to my rear battery. I ran a Cadence ZRS-C1 (nearly identical to the AQ2200) and it was fine.

[qoute]Any suggestion on how to hide all that wire? And when you say - alt to batt,'is that just using alternator mounting bolts as the ground? Thank you[/QUOTE]

To hide the wire you'll need to pull out the interior and run the wires under the carpet. I've done it several times. Just pop off the plastic pieces around the side, remove the two front seats (2 bolts and 2 clips each) remove the center console, remove the rear seat, undo the clips holding the carpet down and you're good to go.

Having the interior out is a good time to add some deadener/MLV too. There's a grommet on the passenger side and that's a great place to run the 1/0 through. Nick was talking about grounding to each rear strut tower and also having a dedicated ground from the front to back. You don't need to ground that dedicated run at the alt, I would ground it on the - terminal at the battery.

Quote:
Is their a cheaper alternative to xs power batteries? I'm assuming deka is good since you are running them, I will have to look into those.
I have a rebranded Deka AGM up front and a XS Power XP750 in the rear. I'd say go with Deka AGMs.

Link to some helpful pics: http://forum.realmofexcursion.com/bu...tml#post922184


You can see the inside w/ the interior out in some of those vids too. You're gonna need to get a good amount of deadener. I'd recommend taking an entire weekend to rip out the interior, deaden, install, and try to do away with rattles. The rear deck causes rattles like a mofo as well as the rear bumper, trunk lid, and spoiler.
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Old 04-12-2013   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

Thanks, I've already installed deadener rear deck still rattles like a mofo, as far as why all aq, their amps were pretty cheap and figured would just stick with the subs too! Im still looking around though nothing's ever written stone, my friend is urging me down the sundown SA road, can they handle that much power? Have any other sub recommendations in that wattage range and $300 or less a sub? I'm open to suggestion, I am a still a noob when it comes to the higher power stuff. Im going to check out that link when i get out of work. and look into deka batteries too.Thank you.
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Old 04-12-2013   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtydonkey View Post
Thanks, I've already installed deadener rear deck still rattles like a mofo, as far as why all aq, their amps were pretty cheap and figured would just stick with the subs too! Im still looking around though nothing's ever written stone, my friend is urging me down the sundown SA road, can they handle that much power? Have any other sub recommendations in that wattage range and $300 or less a sub? I'm open to suggestion, I am a still a noob when it comes to the higher power stuff. Im going to check out that link when i get out of work. and look into deka batteries too.Thank you.
Sundown X series is on preorder right now $300 per 12. They're rated for 1,250w rms but can take 3k
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Old 04-12-2013   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

Wow, those thing can move! I'm thinking I'm going that direction! Lol for now ill probably change my mind 5 times before I actually order anything.
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Old 04-13-2013   #8 (permalink)
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Thanks for the info, and linking to your thread there was a lot of useful Information there. I really like your box too!
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Old 04-13-2013   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtydonkey View Post
Wow, those thing can move! I'm thinking I'm going that direction! Lol for now ill probably change my mind 5 times before I actually order anything.
haha yea man, those x's will be much better than some hdc3's for you.

yea i use the alt mounting bolts for grounds.

kinda nuts how many people on here have 04+ gp's lol.







there's something that will quiet down your rear deck immensely. I used some mdf to make the trapezoid piece and covered it in grill cloth. just used some short screws from the back side.
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Old 04-13-2013   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

That's looks nice, ill need to get creative when I have some free time! How do you guys feel about welding wire? Found some on eBay locally here in michigan 50' of 3/0 they say is good for 500 amps could I just do one run + - with that and call it good? Only $180. Looking at double that price for 3 + runs and 2- of 0awg OFC. I've been reading mixed reviews on the welding wire tho.
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Old 04-13-2013   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

Royal Excelene welding wire is great stuff. Can't go wrong with it!
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Old 04-13-2013   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

welding wire can sometimes be a little stiff for bends and corners but works just fine. and with 3/0 i would imagine that it's not gonna be too easy easy to flex.
if your load is as you stated than 3/0 should be sufficient.

one of the wise ones may have better info/advice than i.
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Old 04-13-2013   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

I know the GP is a long car but why 50 ft? 25 could do the big three and save you some money... although if you do a dedicated alt ground you may need the extra.
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Old 04-13-2013   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtydonkey View Post
That's looks nice, ill need to get creative when I have some free time! How do you guys feel about welding wire? Found some on eBay locally here in michigan 50' of 3/0 they say is good for 500 amps could I just do one run + - with that and call it good? Only $180. Looking at double that price for 3 + runs and 2- of 0awg OFC. I've been reading mixed reviews on the welding wire tho.
3/0 is good for 2x the current of 1/0, roughly. 50 ft should be just right to take care of your big 3 as well.

should put you on the right track there man. care to share a link just to make sure it looks good?
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Old 04-13-2013   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

I second having 50'

That would be enough for two dedicated runs front to back, the big 3, and some extra grounds.
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Old 04-13-2013   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

Here's a link 50' 3 0 Welding or Battery Cable Black Made in USA New | eBay hope it works I'm in my phone .
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

that wire is pretty cheap my knukonceptz 1/0 was just as much as that... there are plenty of people on here that are religious about cheap welding wire.... i would have gotten some but audio grade wire is just so flexible.. if you do get the 3/0 i would run it maybe under the car in some flexible conduit as to make the install a little easier... i dont know how flexible that it but it is 3/0 and it might not be forgiving around tight bends or corners...
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

now i know this company doesn't carry 3/0 ring terminals but if you get some 1/0, 2/0, or 4,0 they have great stuff from what i can tell Connectors | WindyNation.com
thank [MENTION=21812]KingPen[/MENTION] for that link its where i got it...
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Default Re: Electrical: to much or not enough.

Welding Cable 3 0 Black 50

the flexaprene is a bit more flexibile, the actual wire is identical though.

they're both the same price and both will do a great. I'd just make sure to get heat shrink for the ring terminals for wire like that, as the untinned copper is the most sensitive to corrosion.
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